8500 GT Nvidia Video jitter

[boborg]

I bought a Nvidia 8500 GT a week ago but not seeing the results I had hoped for regarding tv-out playback quality. My old acient Ati could play video smooth on s-video tv out but I cannot get the same experience from my new Nvidia Gigabyte 8500 GT.

 

I've tried several drivers, several video codecs (Nvidia 1.02-223 purevideo decoder and Cyberlink 7.3) but I cannot get pass getting jitter video after a while playing a channel in DVBViewer or playing a mpg file in DVBViewer or VLC player for that matter. If I go to a news channel with a news ticker everything initially runs smooth after a while 1-3 minutes sometimes longer then the jitter start and video no longer is rendered smooth. After investigating I suspect some movement in the video or panning triggers it. I then need to change channel or pause/play for it to run smooth again. This happens both in WinXP and Vista.

 

I've set up tv out on s-video, tv standard PAL B, size 720x576, overlay mode. Got a Core2Duo 6600, 2 GB RAM, TT S-3200, FireDTV DVB-C.

 

I've tried to install reclock thinking that may solve it, but frankly either I did not get something right or whatever because after installing it no playback at all. Windows Media Player, zoom player or Cyberlink 7.3 just hangs when opening video.

 

Is there some genius out there that can solve my troubles and bringing some joy to my Nvidia investment. Cause I'm out of ideas myself

Edited June 9, 2007 by boborg

[Dr. Cain]

Set the output of the framebuffer to 50 Hz?

[boborg]

Framebuffer where is that setting? Refresh rate is set to 50 Hz in display properties.

Edited June 10, 2007 by boborg

[Dr. Cain]

If it's set to 50 Hz in display options, it should work. Try turning on V-Sync

[Moses]

It sounds a bit like the Nvidia VRM Bug, doesn't it? Try to switch to overlay renderer (if you are using just one display) or switch on the nvidia VRM fix and see if that helps.

[ricabullah]

Hi boborg!

 

Firt of all, i don't think there is a conflict with NVidia Forcaware drivers with your 8500 more than 8600GTS:(i mean the stabilization problems you stated before.)

 

Here

 

When you look at the results of the benchmark you will see there is no difference between 8500, 8600 and even 8800; especially on Vista for both VC1 and H264. ( Since XP official drivers has been used, 8500 seems a little bit worse on CPU consumption.)

 

I think whenever you change -especially NVidia's-the drivers you will have problem when you turn back. I mean, say you loaded 165.01 and after uninstalling you reloaded ex-one, say 158.**. Believe me, blue screen is guarantee.

 

Let me suggest two things alternatively:

1)Choose a system restore point before you bought your 8500 and restore the sistem to that date. Reinstall 165.01 for XP.

2)Or restore your system to that time and reinstall latest official drivers for Vista. At least we are sure both Cyberlink and Elecard MC avc filters is ready for PurevideoHD on Vista.

Edited June 12, 2007 by ricabullah

[CiNcH]

When you look at the results of the benchmark you will see there is no difference between 8500, 8600 and even 8800; especially on Vista for both VC1 and H264.

Well, the difference between 8500/8600 and 8800 is quite big when it comes to Vista and H.264 which is to be expected (due to the facts that Vista driver which was used supports PV2 and that H.264 is fully accelerated in PV2). So take another look at the THG CPU statistics .

Edited June 12, 2007 by CiNcH

[ricabullah]

Lets say, for h264, 8800 is worse than his sisters. It is truth. But here, i think, our friend is anxious whether there is any difference between 8500 and 8600. (He thinks new unofficial drivers matches 8600 more than 8500, i guess)

Edited June 12, 2007 by ricabullah

[CiNcH]

One thing I do not trust in this article is the massive difference between 8500 and 8600 in VC-1 test under Windows XP. Since PV2 isn't supported with the driver used, the 8600 is supposed to perform as bad as the 8500.

Edited June 12, 2007 by CiNcH

[ricabullah]

I hundred percent agree. But the drivers used in this test for XP must be stupid ones.

[Koray Ustuner]

Dear Boborg,

Could you try Nvidia 1.02-233 purevideo decoder? Not 1.02-223.

And also in Cyberlink 7.3, dont forget to enable hardware acceleration from configuration->video menu.

[BertM]

I can only agree with Boborg.

Earlier this week I replaced my ATI1950 with an nVidia8600GTS. With the 165.01 beta drivers for XP H.264 runs perfectly smooth for both encrypted (euro1080) and FTA channels (BBC-HD, Anixe etc). Processor usage (core duo 6600) at 0% - 1%, 5%-10% with OSD. Unfortunately, MPEG2 which is about 99.99% of the current sat coverage, shows hickups in the video, no matter what decoder/renderer combination is used. Best results with BitControl decoder (software bob double rate mode) and renderer set to Unchanged. This shows ticker tapes (CNBC) perfectly smooth for about 2 minutes and then starts juddering/showing hickups. Other channels show hickups in fast movement which is very annoying.

It is really strange that people report the nvidia 8000 series to be perfect for video; I simply cannot get a smooth picture from it. It is as if the frequency isn't exactly 50Hz.

So I put my good old ATI1950 back in, and enjoy smooth picture in mpeg. For now, I will take the occasional hickups in H264 HD channels (with mainconcept in software mode) for granted, keeping in mind I watch 99% SD channels.

 

I know I will wait for the new ATI HD2600 to be available before I change my video card again...

 

BTW, my output is set to 1920 * 1080p @ 50Hz, DVI->HDMI on a sharp full HD screen.

 

regards, Bert

[boborg]

Well nice to know I'm not the only one. I have settled for VMR 9 which seem to work the best for me at the moment. Think I'll see how good the new ATI series is going to be and perhaps switch back to Ati.

Edited June 16, 2007 by boborg

[vonMengen]

I bought a Nvidia 8500 GT a week ago but not seeing the results I had hoped for regarding tv-out playback quality. My old acient Ati could play video smooth on s-video tv out but I cannot get the same experience from my new Nvidia Gigabyte 8500 GT.

 

I've tried several drivers, several video codecs (Nvidia 1.02-223 purevideo decoder and Cyberlink 7.3) but I cannot get pass getting jitter video after a while playing a channel in DVBViewer or playing a mpg file in DVBViewer or VLC player for that matter. If I go to a news channel with a news ticker everything initially runs smooth after a while 1-3 minutes sometimes longer then the jitter start and video no longer is rendered smooth. After investigating I suspect some movement in the video or panning triggers it. I then need to change channel or pause/play for it to run smooth again. This happens both in WinXP and Vista.

 

I've set up tv out on s-video, tv standard PAL B, size 720x576, overlay mode. Got a Core2Duo 6600, 2 GB RAM, TT S-3200, FireDTV DVB-C.

 

I've tried to install reclock thinking that may solve it, but frankly either I did not get something right or whatever because after installing it no playback at all. Windows Media Player, zoom player or Cyberlink 7.3 just hangs when opening video.

 

Is there some genius out there that can solve my troubles and bringing some joy to my Nvidia investment. Cause I'm out of ideas myself

 

same here with the 8600 GT

 

jitter ..judder ...crappy performance with every decoder and DVBViewer pro

 

see my posts in the DVBViewer HDTV forum (unfortunately in German )

see my posts avs forum (in English) ..... nick Mine

 

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....27#post10802627

Edited June 17, 2007 by vonMengen

[arfster]

VonMengen above got me into investigating this a bit, and found something odd. With my system (Vista32, DVBViewer, 8500GT, 158.45 drivers) I had never seen this on British/Spanish channels, but was pointed to CNBC Europe, N24, Phoenix etc.

 

On those channels, the problem is that the decoder in hardware mode is constantly flickering between film and video, at completely inappropriate moments (ie when it's clearly video on screen). THis causes judder, interlacing artifacts, jitter and is pretty unwatchable.

 

I recorded a couple of minutes of CNBC to test in graphedit, and found the fault lies with the purevideo decoder. Switch to the MPEG2 decoder from the latest Powerdvd 2911 patch and EVR and it's all OK. Solid 50fps on the EVR stats, zero jitter/framedrop, perfectly deinterlaced, no artifacts. Perhaps the NVidia failure is a sympton of the NVidia decoder being DXVA1-only, who knows. It is more than a year out of date, after all.

 

However, this isn't much of a solution for DVBViewer, because the powerdvd2911 mpeg2 decoder will not work properly with 8500GT hardware acceleration and VMR7/9 anymore, in any application - you get a blankscreen with audio most of the time (back to the 2605 version and it's fine, but that's useless cos it can't play many Bluray discs). It does the same in graphedit and all directshow apps - you need to use EVR, at least in Vista.

 

As with AVC playback, EVR would appear to be needed for the 8500/8600, otherwise there's no proper deinterlacing. CPU isn't an issue of course, you can stick it in software mode, but then you're stuck with a low-res low-bitrate source being bobbed.

Edited June 16, 2007 by arfster

[arfster]

Little addition: the Sonic video decoder also works perfectly with hardware acceleration on the troublesome cnbc recording, but again only with EVR. In VMR9 it just plays the whole thing in film mode 25fps.

 

Edit: forgot to try DVBViewer GE. It works perfectly in EVR mode on all troublesome channels (n24, cnbc, etc). No video/film flickering, perfect. What's more interesting is that when you switch from purevideo+vmr9 to powerdvd+evr, the deinterlacing of text and sharp edges improves. It's not a scaling improvement, nor a motion-adaptive thing on news tickers , but simply better deinterlacing - the nvidia one seems to be doing the most basic possible bob line doubling, with consequent detail loss compared to proper hardware deinterlacing.

Edited June 17, 2007 by arfster

[vonMengen]

Little addition: the Sonic video decoder also works perfectly with hardware acceleration on the troublesome cnbc recording, but again only with EVR. In VMR9 it just plays the whole thing in film mode 25fps.

 

Edit: forgot to try DVBViewer GE. It works perfectly in EVR mode on all troublesome channels (n24, cnbc, etc). No video/film flickering, perfect. What's more interesting is that when you switch from purevideo+vmr9 to powerdvd+evr, the deinterlacing of text and sharp edges improves. It's not a scaling improvement, nor a motion-adaptive thing on news tickers , but simply better deinterlacing - the nvidia one seems to be doing the most basic possible bob line doubling, with consequent detail loss compared to proper hardware deinterlacing.

 

Hi arfster

nice coincidence as we seem to do exactly the same tests in parallel .

You know I went through this hell one year ago with my 7600 GT without any assistance til I gave up and sold the card.

The ati 1950 did the trick out of the box.

 

XP :

 

 

here even the 2911 patch 7.3 jitters every 2 or 3 minutes as hell ...

to get rid of the blankscreens you have to rebuild the graph three or fourtimes. best is to use renderer unchanged in the pro.

 

As jitter doesn`t occur if you play back a recorded jittery stream in DVBViewer pro I came to the same conclusion :

 

you are right the only working solution is to use Grigas edition and the EVR renderer

 

Only drawback is you get some tearing on the plasma , i have to investigate if vertical synchronisation has some effect

on this.

 

So Question is does Christian integrate the EVR renderer in the PRO ???? and when ?

 

I gonna switch back frome the buggy 165. forceware to 101.02 to get H.264 bacceleration back ...will keep you informed.

 

in fact i am dissapointed again by NVidia : picture quality for me is not overwhelming because the deinterlacing algorithms are not

on par with ATIs more sophisticated vector and adaptive denterlacing ...

 

 

best regards

 

vm

Edited June 17, 2007 by vonMengen

[spAik]

ati isnt any better. they had bugs in their avivo till the end and didnt fix it (i had a x1600 pro) for me the IQ is the same with my 8800 regarding the deinterlacing. Why dont you all try the newest drivers?

[Tjod]

So Question is does Christian integrate the EVR renderer in the PRO ???? and when ?

Take a look here.

[vonMengen]

ati isnt any better. they had bugs in their avivo till the end and didnt fix it (i had a x1600 pro) for me the IQ is the same with my 8800 regarding the deinterlacing. Why dont you all try the newest drivers?

 

 

hi spaik

 

same discussion on avs …:-)

don´t let us get back in a Nvidia-TI battle

 

I tried the 1600 hdmi ...

for one day....... only.... omg

 

bought a 1950 pro , modded the bios to 13,6 % fanspeed for my HTPC (noiseless)

voila ! worked out of the box with the best PQ over VGA I saw so far

smooth motion, perfect pans , no jitter , no judder

and worked perfectly with powerstrip and accurate timings ..(I need slightly modified timings for the PanaHDPlasma)

 

right now , NVidia has to approve their drivers and their hardware a lot more

to get me back as a customer

 

may be be they win the battle for the best gamercard

but for HQ video on the PC or Mac I think they will loose the battle

 

honestly I don`t believe I gonna keep the 8xxxx --

back to the 8..... issues with DVBViewer...

 

best

 

m

[spAik]

i think i am like everyone switching between both brands. I just wanted to say i was very disappointed by atis false promises with avivo. I think the 88** cards are good ones, its just that the drivers are very bad atm

[ricabullah]

Good Day boys!

 

CiNcH and I say HA is active in XP32(by 165.01) without EVR. message 717

 

I personally insist on having no problem on nor HD neither SD using new DVB Filter(30.04.2007). I use DVBViewerPro and Griga's graphSelector.

And i can make my custom graphs and be able to use Cyberlink's and NVidia's mpeg filters with HA. PV1(non-EVR).

For avc just Cyberlink's avc filter(7.3***) is running with HA.(for the time being)-don't forget it is available with ULTRA edition of PowerDVD.

 

I gave CPU usage in avs forum; you can find on the link vonMengen has given.

And i've discovered Cyberlink's avc filter(7.3.2911) does not work with NFW3. This time you will get black screen.(FW 165.01)- i mean doesn't work with third party soft like Viewer.

Another advice: use new DVBFilter.(30/4 dated)

 

 

Griga and vonMengen work with GE under XP with NFW3 of Microsoft so as to activate EVR without DX10 of Vista.. I think vonMengen uses 158.22 FW. But still have complaints on both for avcHD and mpgSD streams.

 

Some says it is working well under XP with 165.01 for HD channels but doesn't give good results with SD mpg streams. No filter is responding well(?)

With the 165.01 beta drivers for XP H.264 runs perfectly smooth for both encrypted (euro1080) and FTA channels (BBC-HD, Anixe etc). Processor usage (core duo 6600) at 0% - 1%, 5%-10% with OSD. Unfortunately, MPEG2 which is about 99.99% of the current sat coverage, shows hickups in the video, no matter what decoder/renderer combination is used. Best results with BitControl decoder (software bob double rate mode) and renderer set to Unchanged.

 

arfster uses Vista with GE, but share the same problems of vonMergen.(i don't know if he tried Elecard's MC filter?)

 

Hey boys, why don't you upload any avc-mpg-ts, recorded from problematic channels, so i will give a try.

(But do not forget while recording with Viewer cancel decoders;just record. -If you have problems.)

 

by the way mine awaiting your trial results on SD to HD graphs.

 

Best!

Edited June 17, 2007 by ricabullah

[arfster]

To clarify this a little, there appear to be two distinct issues:

 

1) The playback jitter/judder. This is nothing to do with DVBViewer - you can record a TS file and see the same thing happen via graphedit, using Haali splitter>purevideo>vmr, where the purevideo properties page shows the film/video flag detection is completely confused. The Cyberlink decoder is not similarly confused, but it needs EVR for DXVA in Vista, and maybe in XP.

Here's a sample of some video content that is causing this problem (note only some channels have this issue):

 

http://rapidshare.com/files/37772647/06-16...n_group.ts.html

 

 

2) That the Cyberlink 2911patch mpeg2 decoder needs EVR is a separate problem - it makes sense that it does so, because 2911 was when PDVD switched to using EVR. In XP I don't know - to check which mode the cyberlink decoder is running in, simply look at the evr stats - when dxva is off, it weaves to 25fps. Obviously film content will also play at 25fps, so use the clip above. It's pure video material, which is how cyberlink/evr plays it for me (50fps, 0 jitter/framedrop), but purevideo/vmr9 will flick video>film>video, resulting in awful jitter and a frame rate in the mid 30s (drops when film, rises when video).

 

This point also is nothing to do with DVBViewer, beyond suggesting that EVR might be useful to implement, at least for 8500/8600 users.

[ricabullah]

The playback jitter/judder. This is nothing to do with DVBViewer - you can record a TS file and see the same thing happen via graphedit, using Haali splitter>purevideo>vmr, where the purevideo properties page shows the film/video flag detection is completely confused. The Cyberlink decoder is not similarly confused, but it needs EVR for DXVA in Vista, and maybe in XP.

 

Hi arfster, thanks for uploading!

 

I checked out with XP using a 8600 GTS from Asus without EVR-no NetFRW3- /CPU E6600, RAM 2*1GB 800Mhz/

 

I watched your file using Graph;

1)Cyberlink Demux+Cyberlink Video/SP decoder(V.7.3.2911)+VideoRenderer

 

2)NVidia Transport Demux+NVidia Video decoder+VideoRenderer.

 

For both applications PV1 has been activated (HA for SD mpg) For both, CPU usage stayed at %1-3 level. Another trick; Cyberlink decoder did not work when i wanted to deactivate HA.

I have seen jitter in just one scene on the tie(or cravat) of J. Podhoretz.

Both Cyberlink and NVidia gave the same result. Even it is a studio shot i saw still interlace artifacts left. My opinion this broadcast of CNBC Europe is completely disaster; it is just a 704*576 worse than the worse i have ever seen(i've seen much much better 544*576's). I don't think it's up to VGA card. (but anyway did you cancel decoders while recording?-i ask for the jitter point of view.)

 

On the otherhand, i've been still waiting for problematic avc mpg-ts record. Pls. cancel video decoders while rec.

 

Best!

Edited June 17, 2007 by ricabullah

[vonMengen]

Hi first settlers who get the arrows ... :-)

 

sorry to say I am away for 2 days with my bicycle in the swiss alps

 

but last test here with the EVR under XP showed that in my config. this the only way to avoid Jitter

 

Though motion with this renderer looks horrible

looks like a 25 p camera wihout vertical filtering

 

see you in 2 days .. and I am pretty convinced there are some solutions when I am back .... :-)

 

keep rockin.....

[ricabullah]

but last test here with the EVR under XP showed that in my config. this the only way to avoid Jitter

 

Clarify pls, what you mean?

 

By the way, have a nice vacation!

[arfster]

For both applications PV1 has been activated (HA for SD mpg) For both, CPU usage stayed at %1-3 level. Another trick; Cyberlink decoder did not work when i wanted to deactivate HA.

I have seen jitter in just one scene on the tie(or cravat) of J. Podhoretz.

Both Cyberlink and NVidia gave the same result. Even it is a studio shot i saw still interlace artifacts left. My opinion this broadcast of CNBC Europe is completely disaster; it is just a 704*576 worse than the worse i have ever seen(i've seen much much better 544*576's). I don't think it's up to VGA card. (but anyway did you cancel decoders while recording?-i ask for the jitter point of view.)

 

OK - but what do your VMR stats say? (50 or 25, any jitter/framedrop?). What about the purevideo properties page - is it showing film or video?

 

Anyway, further progress: you can disable hardware acceleration in purevideo, watch the properties page, and it continues to flick between film and video. This means the graphics card isn't the problem - the fault lies entirely with the purevideo decoder misanalysing the DVB stream (even when set to automatic, when it should be flagreading rather than bitstream analysing). The Cyberlink one does not do this, probably because it's more than a year newer.

 

As for the recording, it's a .ts file - in other words a raw dump of what's coming off the satellite, not a re-encode. That .ts file displays exactly the same behaviour on playback as the channel does live. Yes, it's certainly a very poor troublesome broadcast, but that's why I picked it - the Nvidia decoder for some reason just can't handle it. Possibly it's some flagging error in the NTSC>PAL conversion.

 

Anyway, N24 and various other German channels have similar errors with the purevideo decoder to a lesser degree, but no UK or Spanish channels do as far as I know. For example, I just watched the entire Real Madrid match on Canal+, and got a constant 50fps with 0 jitter/framedrop. If I flick over to CNBC, it's still doing the video>film>video>film dance.

Edited June 17, 2007 by arfster

[ricabullah]

"any jitter/framedrop?"

I have told i've seen jitter on one scene, but no dropping frame.

 

"What about the purevideo properties page - is it showing film or video?"

Makes no difference ; i tried with both automatic and smart modes; result never changed. i did not check for film or video additionally.

 

"The Cyberlink one does not do this, probably because it's more than a year newer"

Believe me, i've seen no difference between two filters.

 

"As for the recording, it's a .ts file - in other words a raw dump of what's coming off the satellite, not a re-encode. That .ts file displays exactly the same behaviour on playback as the channel does live."

I say there is difference between the records which is decoded while dumping and just dumped without decoding.

I guess you recorded while watching?

 

If so, that is not what i need.

 

I appreciate who sends raw problematic mpg-ts (without watching at the same time).

Listen what Griga says:

Work-around for the moment: Record with DVBViewer Pro (switch playback completely off: View -> Close Graph), and play the file in DVBViewer GE, while it is recorded. A kind of forced timeshift...

Edited June 17, 2007 by ricabullah

[arfster]

I have told i've seen jitter on one scene, but no dropping frame.

.....

Makes no difference ; i tried with both automatic and smart modes; result never changed. i did not check for film or video additionally.

 

This does make a difference - there are quite a few scenarios where you won't notice it, but the decoder will still be continuously changing. For example, if I use nvidia with VMR9, I get software mode because it's not a dxva2 decoder, and thus no visible jitter because (misread) film and weaved video look identical. The problem still exists though, it's just not visible to the naked eye because another factor is masking it.

 

This issue with the purevideo decoder is proven to be the problem. It happens in software and hardware mode, in all applications. The common factor is purevideo - replace with any other hardware deinterlacing decoder (eg sonic or pdvd), or software ones like dscaler or mpv, and it goes away. Thus, I'd like to know if the same thing happens in XP, and the way to tell is whether your properties page is switching between film and video on that clip.

 

Either way, we discover something: that the purevideo decoder is fundamentally broken by Vista drivers or perhaps the dxva1>dxva2 translation layer, or more likely that the channel (and others) are misanalysed under all situations by purevideo.

 

I guess you recorded while watching?

 

No, I dumped it with Mediaportal tvserver on another machine. As before, the problems visible in playback from that TS are identical to those watching CNBC live.

Edited June 18, 2007 by arfster

[ricabullah]

This does make a difference - there are quite a few scenarios where you won't notice it, but the decoder will still be continuously changing. For example, if I use nvidia with VMR9, I get software mode because it's not a dxva2 decoder, and thus no visible jitter because (misread) film and weaved video look identical. The problem still exists though, it's just not visible to the naked eye because another factor is masking it.

 

I disabled HA on NVidia leave it automatic, nothing has changed except CPU consumption. I saw the jitter at just the same point. I haven't seen any dropping frame.

But when i switched both video or film, i found dropped frames in addition to jitter.

 

Thus, I'd like to know if the same thing happens in XP, and the way to tell is whether your properties page is switching between film and video on that clip.

 

Let me say decoder never changed, never switched between film and video.

 

On the other hand, still no difference between NV or Cyberlink filters when HA is activated.

 

I don't know whether it is good news or bad news for you?

Edited June 18, 2007 by ricabullah

[arfster]

Let me say decoder never changed, never switched between film and video.

 

Weird, which did it select then, film or video? (when you're on auto/smart). Talking about the video format box in the purevideo properties page. On mine it's mostly "full frame video", but quite often "full frame film". Clearly it should be video the whole way through, since the original was shot on video. Oh, and if video, are you getting 50fps in the renderer properties page (use vmr9 here btw, "video renderer" in graphedit is vmr7, which the cyberlink decoder doesn't work well with).

 

Hard trying to correlate different reports here - the Vista difference is quite significant because of that dxva1>2 translation. In theory that shouldn't do anything when the decoder is in software mode, but you never know quite what the drivers are interfering with.

[vonMengen]

just very quick , because I am leaving

 

This is on XP

 

this jitter is completely independent from the decoder

I pointed this out last year on AVS in various postings

 

This jitter happens ONLY in NVidia -DVBViewer setups

 

Switching to an ATI card ...and it will completely vanish !

 

you can find it here with every decoder I Tested : NVidia 160- - 200. , PowerDVD 6- 7.3., Mainconcept; Nero

 

To see it you have to do 3 things :

 

a. You have to switch to one of the problematic channels : i.e. ntv, N24 , Phoenix, ZDF Doku , ZDF Theaterkanal

 

occasional hiccups can happen as well in other channels , right now one hiccup in "das Erste".

 

b.Use 50 Hz setups , c. Use VRM , and be PATIENT , it can last as long as 2-3 minutes before it starts, or it may start immediately.

to get used to it you may look at the tickertapes of NTV or N24 ..soon or later it will happen.

 

and arfster is right , best to see the phenomena is installing the NVidiaPurevideo decoder , here in the controlpanel you see the film-video switching

 

of this flag reading decoder at its best.

 

I tried everything last year (tickets to Nvidia support incl. ) til I gave up .... at the very same moment I installed the ATI card ..bingo... gone.

 

No jittering, smooth pans, no jerky motion.

 

Look for BertMs perfect description on page 1

 

 

For me the only point of investigation is why does this happen only in NVIDIA-DVBViewer combos.

 

Anyone who uses another DVB/s programm with Nvidiacards , may be with the 8xxxxseries ?

 

**** and please guys .... people who have no problems looking at PAL football with 60 Hz panels , people who don`t care about judder - pans , jerkyness

 

don`t read this , if you get sensitive to this kind of problems you won`t be happy again.

Edited June 18, 2007 by vonMengen

[ricabullah]

Hi arfster!

 

This evening, i repeated the tests.

 

It is gonna be a confirmation of your tests.

 

When i choose smart or automatic, in soft mode, as you told it's flickering between "full frame video" and "full frame film" when i check out frame seems 25 like film from Renderer properties page.

When you choose "video" it seems to stay at video (at "video format") but frame is again 25.

I've seen what i saw yesterday, just one jitter, but video quality is worse than the worst. Nothing has changed in any trial.

 

Those tests has been made not only under the gui of DVBViewer but also made on Graphedit both using VMR and VMR9.

Result has not changed.

So i don't think i agree with you mine; because in graph that time, there was neither DVBSource, nor DVBV OSD Source filter.

 

This jitter happens ONLY in NVidia -DVBViewer setups

Edited June 18, 2007 by ricabullah

[arfster]

When i choose smart or automatic, in soft mode, as you told it's flickering between "full frame video" and "full frame film" when i check out frame seems 25 like film from Renderer properties page.

When you choose "video" it seems to stay at video (at "video format") but frame is again 25.

 

Thanks - that all makes sense. In software mode video it will stay at 25fps because it weaves everything, but this ends up looking identical to film, at least with PAL (with NTSC weaving telecined film looks horrible).

 

Anyway, you're showing the same root issue as me and VMwith purevideo, but as above other factors decide what problems this actually shows visually. If you have hardware acceleration working properly, you should be at 50fps ...... does this happen for you? For me it continues flickering between film/video, but now video is at 50fps, so you get judder/jitter as it constantly switches between 25 and 50. Only with the PDVD decoder, and EVR to make it work, does it sit exactly on a lovely smooth 50fps.

[ricabullah]

If you have hardware acceleration working properly, you should be at 50fps ...... does this happen for you? For me it continues flickering between film/video, but now video is at 50fps, so you get judder/jitter as it constantly switches

 

What decoder do you want me to try in HA?

[ricabullah]

I tried with NVidia and Cyberlink in HA mode. Cyberlink gives 50 frames while NVidia gives 24-25. VMR9 has been used.

NVidia kept flickering between video and film.

But the result hasn't changed.

[arfster]

I tried with NVidia and Cyberlink in HA mode. Cyberlink gives 50 frames while NVidia gives 24-25. VMR9 has been used.

NVidia kept flickering between video and film.

But the result hasn't changed.

 

Aha, looks like the purevideo decoder isn't hardware accelerating mpeg2 for you at all, due to XP or the drivers (for me it is with VMR9, in Vista). When hardware accelerating video, you'll always get 50fps (unless you've forced weave of course).

 

Thus, you have the same issue of video/film misdetection as me, but you don't see the same visible effects without hardware acceleration.

[vonMengen]

Aha, looks like the purevideo decoder isn't hardware accelerating mpeg2 for you at all, due to XP or the drivers (for me it is with VMR9, in Vista). When hardware accelerating video, you'll always get 50fps (unless you've forced weave of course).

 

Thus, you have the same issue of video/film misdetection as me, but you don't see the same visible effects without hardware acceleration.

 

took my laptop :-)

O.k. this trick with graphedit is a nice finding , so I was right last year to nail it down to the 7600 GT NVidia card only , and after trying everything..., to sell it and to be a happy camper again with ATI.

I tried so many workarounds last year. Bought another 7600 GT (MSI >Asus) Someone told me that NVidia is sensitive in terms of application polling , so I disabled even speedfan.

I disabled Intel speedstep , tried an additional fan for the graphiccard , disabled with msconfig every service on earth , installed fresh lean xp copies, even tried reclock , did hundreds of juddertests and tried millions of timingvariations with powerstrip, changed pci slots , installed PCI latency programms, ...nothing .....this card juddered and jittered constantly.

and now its not the 7600 GT its the 8600 GT ....is this a question of the same inconsistent clock or what... ???

 

and imagine I was completely alone last year , everyone seemed to be happy with their juddering NVidias .. felt like an idiot.

 

what really impresses me , before I sell it and loose another 50 € .... is , that this thing seem to work with EVR and DXVA 2 in Vista without problems......

So far I cannot believe it . Are you pretty sure arfster .... ;)

 

this card will get you ..... in exactly the moment when it seems to work...

Edited June 19, 2007 by vonMengen

[ricabullah]

but you don't see the same visible effects without hardware acceleration.

except one jitter and some interlace artifacts.

This broadcast is really horrible.

 

By the way, you are not alone vonMengen, before 8600GTS, i sold my 7950GT in two days after i bought it.

Edited June 19, 2007 by ricabullah

[arfster]

what really impresses me , before I sell it and loose another 50 € .... is , that this thing seem to work with EVR and DXVA 2 in Vista without problems......

So far I cannot believe it . Are you pretty sure arfster .... ;)

 

Seems so, as I've looked at the channels you've specified (feel free to give me any more of your problem ones). Vista, latest DVBViewer Pro and GE, 8500GT, Skystar2, cyberlink 2911. You should be able to get it working in XP with any other DXVA1 decoder though - I don't think anything in Vista or EVR is solving it, it's merely the cyberlink decoder being superior. You could perhaps try the Sonic decoder? It worked fine for me with hardware acceleration.

 

Also, what's working for me isn't much use for DVBViewer, because you need pdvd and evr. Purevideo is DXVA1 only, so doesn't hardware accelerate with EVR. DVBViewer GE is fine obviously, but you're losing a lot of functionality with that.

 

The only element our systems really differ in is the display. However, the above at least produces good output on the computer's side - ie the vmr9/evr stats page shows no frame drop and no jitter. If you have jitter and this is at zero, you have a display timing problem.

Edited June 19, 2007 by arfster